RuPaul’s Drag Race Down Under judge Rhys Nicholson has earned a position amongst a select sect of comedians. They've won most outstanding act at the Melbourne International Comedy Festival, they've had a comedy special commissioned by Netflix and they've joined the rare ranks among those who know what it's like to make RuPaul really belly laugh.
That 'Down Under' label lumps Australia and New Zealand queens together like conjoined twins, under a phrase really only used elsewhere in the world. But Nicholson says despite there being "no real cultural nations" in drag, our corner of the world has inarguably lent the series its own flavour.
"We do have this connection down here that we tend to not take it seriously, I think that's why they've whacked us together. And also, there are probably some contractual reasons.
I think we share a love of drag that is not about female impersonation from my point of view. I think here and in Australia it's kind of that the queens create a character.”
There are other differences too. Generally, Nicholson says, our casts are more supportive of each other so there's less inter-personal drama. It's a thread Nicholson sees in the wider comedy scene as well. "As a stand up, we are always trying to help each other out, get our jokes better and make each other's work better."
As a result, recurring challenges of the international Drag Race series, like the acid tongued reading challenges where competitors roast each other, can come across not as biting.
"Reading is not necessarily fundamental in Australia and New Zealand," says Nicholson, laughing.
This valuing of camaraderie is reflected in the fact that in the past, Nicholson has said they view their role on the judging panel as being a quasi conduit for the audience. Now that the show is in its third season and they're more embedded in the family, has that perspective changed? Or do they still feel a little bit like they're watching from the outside?
"In the first two seasons, I didn't feel like I had earned the space to be saying to drag queens, 'this is what you should be doing', because I'm not a drag queen. But I think I've maybe seen enough to start to be like, this is what we want for this competition.
"I think they [the production] trust me a lot more too. When I got the job in the second season again, it was like ‘you kept the secrets, well done. You respected your NDA and so you can come back!’"
They've gained the trust of the production, but also some life perspective. Like many Kiwi contemporaries, Nicholson came up in the Australian comedy scene as part of a scrappy generation who ripped up the existing playbook and did things their own way.
What does success look and feel like when you’re in your 30s, doing well professionally and getting the accolades you witnessed those ahead of you getting when you were starting out?
The answer seems to be balance and diversification. Nicholson has written a book, Dish, to be released in October, and has been taking broader television opportunities and coming to terms with the fact that maybe now, success is having the luxury of saying no.
"I try really hard not to take it for granted. Only an idiot who's gotten a little bit famous is like, yeah, it's just fame it's not what I ever wanted. Of course, it is. And it's nice, but it can go away.
"I have always hustled because I grew up with no money, in quite a properly poor family. I still feel like if I'm not making money, I am haemorrhaging it. If I say no to something, well they're never gonna ask me again," Nicholson says. "I need to get better at saying no."
Nicholson is also acutely aware that their level of fame is still, by contrast, manageable. There's increased exposure, for sure, but it's still niche. "In a way, being on Drag Race is like doing an ad in Japan," Nicholson says.
"Comedy fame is perfect because there's no paparazzi involved. Our job as comedians is to talk about ourselves, there's no one trying to needle into your life because you've already told them everything."
Early in their career Nicholson didn't see themselves as an inherently political comedian - "I was definitely a gay comedian for a straight audience" - but that seems to be changing, even if it's offstage at first.
Like many in their generation of the LGBTQIA+ community, Nicholson grew up somewhat removed from the realities of the devastation of the AIDS crisis, during a time where our community was gaining freedoms and rights that seemed impossible to even dream of a couple of decades earlier. It made having a more generally flippant outlook about the politicisation of the community more acceptable. But that's changed sharply recently.
"It feels a bit real at the moment, doesn't it?" says Nicholson. "I think maybe people outside of the community don't really know. I think because there's always been so much noise but it's more pointed and has a focus at the moment."
Production for Drag Race Down Under was underway when a flurry of anti-drag legislation was introduced in various US states, and closer to home an Auckland Library was forced to close after a protest interrupted a drag storytime session hosted by drag queen Medulla Oblongata.
Nicholson says seeing how RuPaul reacted and provided context to this resurgence of antipathy towards the community gave them an expanded appreciation for the power of lived experience.
"Every time he opens his mouth, he comes to the context of a queer person who grew up, a person of colour in the deep south of America and was born in the 1960s.
"I think it's really important that we listen to people like him and people of that generation. I think it's really easy to be like, ‘well, they're just old gays…’ yes, their age comes with occasional moments of misunderstanding, but it also comes with an understanding of where we've been.
"They’re of a generation where we lost a lot of those people, and who knows where we would be if we hadn't lost those people and how much stronger our community would be."
That's not to undermine the validity of the perspectives of younger community members though, Nicholson often finds themselves in awe of the next generation who are so sure of themselves. "I look at kids now at this comedy club I own. I used to have to make jokes about my own sexual life to make everyone comfortable in the room. None of them have to do that anymore. That's so wild to me."
When standing in their own identity Nicholson, has taken a little longer to shake off that self-deprecating humour that we reach for instinctively Down Under. Later this year they'll join the cast on the second season of Taskmaster Australia. It's difficult not to draw comparisons between Nicholson's casting and that of Mae Martin who won season 15 of the UK series.
Like Nicholson, Martin is non-binary and uses they/them pronouns. Their appearance on their series has been credited with giving the wider watching public a practical demonstration of how to adopt non-gendered language in their day to day lives. Nicholson says they had a similar experience when interacting with Aussie Taskmaster Tom Gleeson.
"Seeing someone like Gleeson, a man in his 40s who grew up on a farm, correct himself a couple of times. I reckon they won't be in the edit, but I kind of hope sometimes they are because it's showing how easy that interaction is. I'm not freaking out, he's not freaking out. It was just a really enjoyable experience."
New episodes of Drag Race Down Under stream on TVNZ 7pm Fridays
